WEBVTT NOTE Published transcript for Built for Cars, Banned for Bikes, episode 2. Machine transcribed and then corrected and attributed by hand. See tools/build-transcript.py for exactly what was changed. 1 00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:05.820 Okay, this is Built for Cars, Banned for Bikes and I'm Yash Goel here. 2 00:00:05.820 --> 00:00:10.160 Last episode I argued with how people get around a campus and how that is decided by 3 00:00:10.160 --> 00:00:13.000 what got built long before any of them arrived. 4 00:00:13.000 --> 00:00:16.040 The problem with an argument like that is very hard to test. 5 00:00:16.040 --> 00:00:19.720 You can't take one person and put them in two different cities and watch what they do. 6 00:00:19.720 --> 00:00:23.940 Except a university does that constantly and calls it an exchange year. 7 00:00:23.940 --> 00:00:29.840 My guest today spent his last year here and came from a city in Italy. 8 00:00:29.840 --> 00:00:32.600 He's going to introduce himself and where he comes from. 9 00:00:32.600 --> 00:00:35.480 So if you would like to introduce your scenario, please. 10 00:00:35.480 --> 00:00:36.820 Yeah, sure. 11 00:00:36.820 --> 00:00:37.980 My name is Alessandro. 12 00:00:37.980 --> 00:00:45.680 I come from Venice, Italy and I spent last year as an exchange student at UC San Diego. 13 00:00:45.680 --> 00:00:47.560 And yeah, that's it for me. 14 00:00:47.560 --> 00:00:56.760 I studied business econ over there and then right now I'm back home in Venice and I started 15 00:00:56.760 --> 00:00:57.760 working. 16 00:00:57.760 --> 00:01:02.520 So if you could please tell the audience like which cities you've been in Italy and like, 17 00:01:02.520 --> 00:01:08.520 how do you like spend your day at UCSD and how you do you go about in terms of commuting, 18 00:01:08.520 --> 00:01:09.520 that'd be great. 19 00:01:09.520 --> 00:01:10.520 Okay, sure. 20 00:01:10.520 --> 00:01:13.280 So, well, okay. 21 00:01:13.280 --> 00:01:21.280 I originally come from Venice, but I've been all around Italy and I kind of had the chance 22 00:01:21.280 --> 00:01:29.280 to experience the various forms of micromobility in different Italian cities where we mostly, 23 00:01:29.280 --> 00:01:38.040 mostly commute by, I would say by bus and by bike, not rented bikes, like your own bike usually. 24 00:01:38.040 --> 00:01:47.800 And only, only recently they, the government started like, you know, introducing some rented 25 00:01:47.800 --> 00:01:48.800 bikes, rented services. 26 00:01:48.800 --> 00:01:52.800 And, you know, some people started using that. 27 00:01:52.800 --> 00:02:01.560 I didn't personally use those rented bikes as a micromobility way of commuting until I came 28 00:02:01.560 --> 00:02:12.320 to the US and at UCSD, I was constantly using Spin to mostly to commute to class. 29 00:02:12.320 --> 00:02:18.360 But not only, not only for, I don't know, I was going out with friends in the city center 30 00:02:18.360 --> 00:02:20.480 and I was using that. 31 00:02:20.480 --> 00:02:25.440 I was, I really, really used a lot, a lot, the Spin subscript. 32 00:02:25.440 --> 00:02:31.440 I also had a subscription and yeah, I used it every day, every single day. 33 00:02:31.440 --> 00:02:38.280 So, did you, the bikes that you mentioned in like Italy, did you like, hold them on a lease 34 00:02:38.280 --> 00:02:41.840 or did it, was it the same system as Spin or like, what are the differences that you observed 35 00:02:41.840 --> 00:02:42.840 over your past year? 36 00:02:43.560 --> 00:02:49.000 I would say, no, it's, it's pretty much the same, the same system. 37 00:02:49.000 --> 00:02:57.240 You, you can have a, you know, a subscription and then a pay as you go type of, of, of bill 38 00:02:57.240 --> 00:03:00.080 on top of the subscription that you pay. 39 00:03:00.080 --> 00:03:01.600 So it's, it's really similar. 40 00:03:01.600 --> 00:03:02.080 Okay. 41 00:03:02.080 --> 00:03:06.160 So is there like any difference in terms of like infrastructure that you've noticed because 42 00:03:06.160 --> 00:03:09.600 given the fact that you're in this like unique spot where you spend like three years 43 00:03:09.600 --> 00:03:14.520 in a university in Italy and then like one year at UCSD, you also happen to have like a lot 44 00:03:14.520 --> 00:03:16.760 of understanding of the Italian universities for instance. 45 00:03:16.760 --> 00:03:20.920 or like, I believe you studied in a different country than Italy actually. 46 00:03:20.920 --> 00:03:26.640 So, um, if you'd like to introduce, uh, like wherever you did your education from that'd be 47 00:03:26.640 --> 00:03:28.920 very helpful for the viewers. 48 00:03:28.920 --> 00:03:29.920 Yes, sure. 49 00:03:29.920 --> 00:03:36.480 Um, so I did my, the first, actually the first two years of my bachelor, um, in, uh, France 50 00:03:36.480 --> 00:03:37.920 near, near Paris. 51 00:03:37.920 --> 00:03:46.600 The, the city is a small city called, um, um, and, um, and over there I didn't actually 52 00:03:46.600 --> 00:03:49.400 see any, any rented bikes. 53 00:03:49.400 --> 00:03:52.560 Uh, there, I guess there weren't there yet. 54 00:03:52.560 --> 00:03:53.880 So it's a small city. 55 00:03:53.880 --> 00:03:59.640 So probably in Paris, there were already those, those kinds of, of bikes of rented services. 56 00:03:59.640 --> 00:04:07.520 Um, and then in fact spent my, my last and third year of, of my bachelor's degree at UCSD. 57 00:04:07.520 --> 00:04:12.160 Uh, what course were you pursuing during this, uh, entire three years? 58 00:04:12.160 --> 00:04:18.280 Yeah, uh, the course was, uh, was economics actually like, uh, uh, political economics. 59 00:04:18.280 --> 00:04:24.320 And, and, but then, you know, I sort of focused on, on, on business econ just for, for my exchange 60 00:04:24.320 --> 00:04:24.520 here. 61 00:04:24.520 --> 00:04:29.200 Have you also like ever like, uh, owned a bike yourself other than the ones that you rented 62 00:04:29.200 --> 00:04:32.640 in Italy and the ones that you used as Spin in US? 63 00:04:32.640 --> 00:04:40.320 Yes, I, I did own, uh, I did own several bikes, uh, well, both at home and, and during 64 00:04:40.320 --> 00:04:47.400 my studies there, there in France, I, I actually bought, I guess, two or three, uh, two or three 65 00:04:47.400 --> 00:04:54.080 bikes because you know, uh, the, the first two got stolen, uh, and, and, uh, I, I owned 66 00:04:54.080 --> 00:04:58.320 my, my bikes, let's say in, uh, in France that, that for sure. 67 00:04:58.320 --> 00:05:04.800 Um, instead in the US, I just used, uh, I just used rented bikes, maybe because of the, 68 00:05:04.800 --> 00:05:06.400 the short period I was there. 69 00:05:06.400 --> 00:05:09.920 I mean, it's not that short, but you know, like nine, just what? 70 00:05:10.320 --> 00:05:11.320 Uh, three quarters. 71 00:05:11.320 --> 00:05:16.400 Um, but no, no, I never bought my own bike in the US. 72 00:05:16.400 --> 00:05:21.320 Uh, it's funny that you mentioned like, um, theft has like the reason of buying like new 73 00:05:21.320 --> 00:05:25.800 bikes constantly because like, that was one of the thesis of our projects is like theft 74 00:05:25.800 --> 00:05:31.480 is like something that is like actively prohibiting like the, um, like the growth of the micromobility 75 00:05:31.480 --> 00:05:35.960 culture in the States that like every single time a bike gets stolen, like more and more 76 00:05:35.960 --> 00:05:40.920 people like get like, like really, um, uh, feel really like, um, out of this like whole 77 00:05:40.920 --> 00:05:45.700 situation that like, they don't really want to like, um, get into this like micromobility 78 00:05:45.700 --> 00:05:49.300 culture because they would spend like more eventually than they do like renting. 79 00:05:49.300 --> 00:05:53.020 And then like, they would also have to like engage with the charging infrastructure. 80 00:05:53.480 --> 00:05:57.560 So would you, would you say that like, this is the reason that you, that you tend to like 81 00:05:57.560 --> 00:06:01.120 rent more than own because you've experienced loss yourself? 82 00:06:01.120 --> 00:06:05.360 Like, is that one of the primary reasons like making you rent more lately or like? 83 00:06:05.720 --> 00:06:06.900 I guess, I guess, yes. 84 00:06:06.960 --> 00:06:08.420 And that's, that's a very good point. 85 00:06:08.420 --> 00:06:15.860 Uh, when I think of, you know, owning my own, uh, let's say my, my electric bike or electric 86 00:06:15.860 --> 00:06:23.960 scooter, which is a very, very like useful and, um, sort of very comfortable way to, to commute 87 00:06:23.960 --> 00:06:26.440 around town for, for micromobility purposes. 88 00:06:26.440 --> 00:06:32.740 I'm actually put off from, from doing that by, by the risk of, of theft. 89 00:06:32.740 --> 00:06:39.500 Like in my place, like here in Italy, it's virtually impossible not to get, uh, your scooter 90 00:06:39.500 --> 00:06:46.720 or bike stolen, uh, if you don't have a lock and if you don't park it in a very, very safe 91 00:06:46.720 --> 00:06:55.180 area in certain, you know, uh, times of the day, uh, as for the, as for UCSD, well, I didn't 92 00:06:55.180 --> 00:07:02.200 actually have the need, but, um, I guess talking to, talking to friends and hearing them, their 93 00:07:02.200 --> 00:07:07.740 stories, uh, the, the risk of theft was, was, uh, let's say a concrete one. 94 00:07:08.300 --> 00:07:15.360 And, uh, so I would have probably thought a lot before, uh, purchasing my, my own bike 95 00:07:15.360 --> 00:07:18.560 or my, my own scooter, um, at UCSD. 96 00:07:18.560 --> 00:07:25.080 If I, you know, if I've been to, to stay there for, for, uh, I don't know, a few years. 97 00:07:25.520 --> 00:07:29.480 So economics was like one of the major reasons, like renting for you felt cheaper, like over 98 00:07:29.480 --> 00:07:32.200 the course of like those nine months over the headache of like ownership. 99 00:07:32.920 --> 00:07:33.140 Okay. 100 00:07:33.720 --> 00:07:36.760 Uh, has charging played a role in like this whole scenario? 101 00:07:36.760 --> 00:07:40.900 Like, have you ever interacted with the charging infrastructure at UCSD or like, if you've 102 00:07:40.900 --> 00:07:46.220 like used, like your friends, like the unmotorized bikes, so to speak, like there's also like 103 00:07:46.220 --> 00:07:49.740 infrastructure there to like, uh, fill up gas in your bike tires. 104 00:07:49.820 --> 00:07:54.720 So have you ever interacted with those at UCSD or like any other like college campus in the 105 00:07:54.720 --> 00:07:54.960 state? 106 00:07:55.100 --> 00:07:56.540 And how would you rate your experience? 107 00:07:56.540 --> 00:08:01.300 And like, um, like if that has affected your like, um, view views towards like ownership 108 00:08:01.300 --> 00:08:02.920 of a micromobility device? 109 00:08:02.920 --> 00:08:09.340 Well, so I, I, I didn't actually have, uh, uh, direct experience with the, the charging 110 00:08:09.340 --> 00:08:10.960 infrastructure at UCSD. 111 00:08:11.480 --> 00:08:13.440 Um, I just know of some friends. 112 00:08:13.440 --> 00:08:18.780 I don't actually know if that's, that's allowed who, who charged their own vehicles at their 113 00:08:18.780 --> 00:08:20.340 places on campus. 114 00:08:20.940 --> 00:08:29.680 Uh, I don't know which plug, which plug they used, uh, frankly, um, but I guess it's, uh, 115 00:08:29.740 --> 00:08:35.500 I guess it's an important, uh, an important factor to consider where you're, where and how, 116 00:08:35.720 --> 00:08:41.320 and I don't know how expensive, uh, it's going to be to charge your, your vehicle once you already, 117 00:08:41.320 --> 00:08:44.960 you know, uh, invested the money to purchase it. 118 00:08:45.480 --> 00:08:54.200 And, uh, I guess, yes, I guess that's it for, for charging like, uh, yeah, for this topic, 119 00:08:54.260 --> 00:08:54.620 I guess. 120 00:08:55.100 --> 00:08:59.400 Do you, what do you, what do you think is like the, uh, primary reason that like people charge 121 00:08:59.400 --> 00:09:03.980 in their like apartments over like some like specific, like dedicated charging spots? 122 00:09:03.980 --> 00:09:08.260 Like, have you ever seen a dedicated charging spot or like, it's like the lack of those like 123 00:09:08.260 --> 00:09:11.300 driving people to charge in their like spots or like, what would you think? 124 00:09:11.320 --> 00:09:15.020 Because I know that there are like, uh, parking spots on campus. 125 00:09:15.020 --> 00:09:18.780 So like, is there like, are there like no charging spots in those parking locations? 126 00:09:18.780 --> 00:09:23.800 Or like, what are those only meant for like the traditional bikes with like no motors whatsoever? 127 00:09:24.140 --> 00:09:26.260 Like, uh, if, if you know anything about that. 128 00:09:26.260 --> 00:09:26.860 You know what? 129 00:09:26.960 --> 00:09:34.360 I don't actually recall seeing, uh, one of those charging spots for, for like electric vehicles 130 00:09:34.360 --> 00:09:35.040 specifically. 131 00:09:35.560 --> 00:09:37.700 So maybe that's, that's a sign. 132 00:09:37.880 --> 00:09:45.040 That's an indicator of, uh, sort of, uh, not the absence, but like the rarity or the scarcity 133 00:09:45.040 --> 00:09:50.560 of, of these places, this, this, you know, this sort of charging infrastructure. 134 00:09:51.080 --> 00:09:58.460 And to answer your question about why I think like people would, you know, uh, charge their, 135 00:09:58.560 --> 00:09:59.740 their vehicles at home. 136 00:10:00.300 --> 00:10:02.440 Um, I guess, yeah, for sure. 137 00:10:02.520 --> 00:10:08.900 You know, the, the fact of, you know, the comfort and yes, convenience, uh, plays a big, 138 00:10:09.080 --> 00:10:09.620 big role. 139 00:10:09.860 --> 00:10:18.560 And, you know, if I were to own my own vehicle, it would be a huge, a huge, you know, pain during, 140 00:10:18.720 --> 00:10:25.700 during my days, you know, um, taking, taking it upstairs and it's, they're usually very heavy. 141 00:10:26.240 --> 00:10:30.540 And, uh, so that's, that's probably one of the reasons. 142 00:10:30.800 --> 00:10:35.360 I mean, looking from like my experience at UCSD I personally, uh, face the situation that 143 00:10:35.360 --> 00:10:40.320 you're talking about, I used to live in like one of those, like, um, short of like, like 144 00:10:40.320 --> 00:10:43.460 tall enough buildings that they do require you to take their Spin upstairs. 145 00:10:43.460 --> 00:10:48.200 Like if you like, not, not Spin, but like a personally owned, like micromobility scooter, 146 00:10:48.200 --> 00:10:53.260 but like, um, but like not tall enough that they, uh, warranted the need for like an elevator. 147 00:10:53.560 --> 00:10:57.380 So like, I did not have the elevator to like take the scooter upstairs with me easily 148 00:10:57.380 --> 00:11:01.780 and like charge it in my dorm, but like, uh, there was also no like charging infrastructure 149 00:11:01.780 --> 00:11:05.960 in those, like all of those, like, um, bike metal locker places where they have like those 150 00:11:05.960 --> 00:11:09.660 like Q rods coming out of the ground or like in a, in a like dedicated room. 151 00:11:09.880 --> 00:11:14.500 So like, that's why I was stuck with this like option of like renting a micromobility device 152 00:11:14.500 --> 00:11:17.600 rather than like having the option to like actually have the ownership. 153 00:11:18.040 --> 00:11:21.840 One of my suite mates at the time, like had like a removable battery bike. 154 00:11:21.980 --> 00:11:23.640 So he was able to get around with it. 155 00:11:23.680 --> 00:11:27.240 He just like dragged the battery upstairs with him, charged it and then like 156 00:11:27.240 --> 00:11:28.160 brought it back up. 157 00:11:28.260 --> 00:11:32.980 So he had like two of the batteries and rotation, but, um, I've personally felt the 158 00:11:32.980 --> 00:11:37.620 pinch that like there, there's not enough like charging infrastructure nearby for ownership 159 00:11:37.620 --> 00:11:38.700 to actually make sense. 160 00:11:38.920 --> 00:11:43.120 But like, um, if you were in one of those buildings, which are like you says you're 161 00:11:43.120 --> 00:11:47.660 always makes like the ones like, uh, equipped with elevators nowadays, like the hype at all, 162 00:11:47.780 --> 00:11:50.120 like 15 sorry buildings, for instance. 163 00:11:50.360 --> 00:11:55.440 So, um, uh, would you like, did you ever like consider like if you were in one of those 164 00:11:55.440 --> 00:11:56.820 buildings, were you in one of those buildings? 165 00:11:57.100 --> 00:11:59.420 Like, uh, or did your building not available? 166 00:12:00.380 --> 00:12:01.120 No, no, no, no. 167 00:12:01.120 --> 00:12:02.640 Actually I was in I-House. 168 00:12:02.840 --> 00:12:10.180 So no tall buildings, but I know lots of friends that who lived in those sort of flats, uh, like 169 00:12:10.180 --> 00:12:11.460 yeah, tall buildings. 170 00:12:11.600 --> 00:12:12.820 Have you ever heard about those? 171 00:12:12.820 --> 00:12:15.620 Like, um, like scooters that you take on a lease. 172 00:12:15.620 --> 00:12:21.240 So like on Spin, you usually have like, um, like a day long thing or like a pay, pay as 173 00:12:21.240 --> 00:12:21.680 you go thing. 174 00:12:21.740 --> 00:12:26.380 But like, there's also scooters that you can like own for like a month on a, on a rent basis 175 00:12:26.380 --> 00:12:30.240 or like, uh, like you can pay like $50 a month or like $60 a month. 176 00:12:30.240 --> 00:12:32.580 And then you just like keep it and like use as much as you want. 177 00:12:32.640 --> 00:12:33.920 Have you ever heard of those? 178 00:12:34.060 --> 00:12:36.280 I didn't actually know of this option. 179 00:12:36.540 --> 00:12:36.660 No. 180 00:12:36.780 --> 00:12:37.000 Okay. 181 00:12:37.300 --> 00:12:41.540 Would if you, if you knew about that and then like the, because like, then you don't really 182 00:12:41.540 --> 00:12:45.700 have to pay the upfront amount for like the $600, like $700 scooter. 183 00:12:46.080 --> 00:12:48.460 Would it make it like more likely for you to like adopt? 184 00:12:48.580 --> 00:12:53.400 Because like we talked about how like economics of it, like did not make sense for you because 185 00:12:53.400 --> 00:12:54.740 you were on a short stay there. 186 00:12:54.960 --> 00:12:59.940 So like, uh, because like now if you talk about like $60 a month, that comes out to be 187 00:12:59.940 --> 00:13:00.880 like $2 per day. 188 00:13:00.920 --> 00:13:05.420 But if you take like Spin back and forth, you can easily accumulate like $4 to $5 of spend 189 00:13:05.420 --> 00:13:05.720 a day. 190 00:13:05.860 --> 00:13:07.980 So like the economics do shift in your behavior. 191 00:13:07.980 --> 00:13:12.340 So like, would that have made more sense for you and made you adopt micromobility a lot 192 00:13:12.340 --> 00:13:13.480 more than you did? 193 00:13:13.760 --> 00:13:18.820 Like not micromobility per se, but like it's like persistent, like, because, uh, if you 194 00:13:18.820 --> 00:13:24.980 do use that, like, um, like leasing option for a month, I also think like the, like the 195 00:13:24.980 --> 00:13:29.140 usage would have gone up a lot because then you don't really have any incremental cost of 196 00:13:29.140 --> 00:13:30.180 like using it all the time. 197 00:13:30.240 --> 00:13:31.620 So like, what are your views on this? 198 00:13:31.620 --> 00:13:39.280 I would agree on the point that, uh, I would have used that, that leased vehicle way more 199 00:13:39.280 --> 00:13:43.700 because, uh, uh, you know, I would have been concerned with it, with the incremental 200 00:13:43.700 --> 00:13:51.680 costs, but, um, I would also, yes, I, I'd also like to, and to do, you know, to, to specify 201 00:13:51.680 --> 00:13:58.940 that, um, I would have probably been careful, um, about which, which lease, lease option to 202 00:13:58.940 --> 00:13:59.280 choose. 203 00:13:59.840 --> 00:14:06.080 Uh, and I would have probably looked into the, the kind of purchasing terms to see if there's 204 00:14:06.080 --> 00:14:12.900 any, I don't know, insurance costs to pay in case of theft or, uh, yeah, what, what happens 205 00:14:12.900 --> 00:14:20.520 if my, my vehicle gets stolen and if I'm covered, if I have to pay for that, uh, if, if, if so 206 00:14:20.520 --> 00:14:25.220 all the, all the purchasing conditions, I would have been very, very careful to choose that. 207 00:14:25.220 --> 00:14:31.320 And I guess it's, it's sort of, that's a burden as well, you know, sort of decision making 208 00:14:31.320 --> 00:14:34.500 fatigue, uh, among your, your lease and options. 209 00:14:35.940 --> 00:14:40.800 Because you get like this, like responsibility up front that like, you have to like manage 210 00:14:40.800 --> 00:14:42.220 every like thing around it. 211 00:14:42.260 --> 00:14:45.900 Like if it gets lost, like how do you like manage the extra expense or like, does it get 212 00:14:45.900 --> 00:14:46.440 charged to you? 213 00:14:46.540 --> 00:14:48.420 Like the full amount of scooter and like all of that. 214 00:14:48.720 --> 00:14:51.980 But like, if it's been like your ride-ins and your responsibility ends right there. 215 00:14:51.980 --> 00:14:52.980 Yeah, exactly. 216 00:14:52.980 --> 00:14:58.360 And then I, I, I also guess you, um, you know, there, there's lots of exchange students 217 00:14:58.360 --> 00:15:04.720 on campus and cause, and I, I guess, and also in general international students, you have 218 00:15:04.720 --> 00:15:11.680 to put, you know, uh, put yourself in the shoes of those students who already pay, um, a lot 219 00:15:11.680 --> 00:15:18.380 just to be in the U S, uh, um, you know, health insurance, accommodation, uh, all the, you 220 00:15:18.380 --> 00:15:19.880 know, living expenses, et cetera. 221 00:15:20.280 --> 00:15:27.620 And, you know, you always try to, to, to cut and optimize costs and, and probably pick 222 00:15:27.620 --> 00:15:28.820 the safest options. 223 00:15:29.560 --> 00:15:35.880 So I guess I'm just saying there's a lot of, of, uh, of carefulness and consideration when 224 00:15:35.880 --> 00:15:41.340 you have to make other purchasing, purchasing options or leasing options. 225 00:15:41.460 --> 00:15:47.560 So did you ever like, um, happen to use the bus often or like, because there's like a bus 226 00:15:47.560 --> 00:15:53.340 that takes you around UCSD and did using that like impact your usage of micromobility and 227 00:15:53.340 --> 00:15:55.776 like, actually, you know, I, 228 00:15:55.776 --> 00:16:00.900 I totally hated taking the bus just because, okay, it's, I, I 229 00:16:00.900 --> 00:16:04.080 remember it's, it was pretty, pretty frequent. 230 00:16:04.080 --> 00:16:05.980 So that's a good, that's a bonus. 231 00:16:06.660 --> 00:16:13.640 Uh, but just, you know, I, I was often in a, in a hurry and, you know, try, try to really 232 00:16:13.640 --> 00:16:19.400 optimize time from one class to another, or, you know, uh, one commitment to another. 233 00:16:19.780 --> 00:16:28.800 So there's no comparison, uh, between how, how convenient a scooter or a bike is compared 234 00:16:28.800 --> 00:16:34.300 to, to a bus, which takes you, yeah, takes you to the stop and then, you know, and also 235 00:16:34.300 --> 00:16:37.040 like it, it doesn't run every single time. 236 00:16:37.040 --> 00:16:44.160 And also, I, I guess I, I can't remember the, the hours, uh, that, that buses run on campus, 237 00:16:44.160 --> 00:16:50.700 but, um, I mean, you know, uh, you, you can always take a Spin even at 2am. 238 00:16:51.020 --> 00:16:52.880 Uh, so yeah. 239 00:16:53.200 --> 00:16:53.500 Yeah. 240 00:16:53.940 --> 00:16:54.180 Yeah. 241 00:16:54.180 --> 00:16:58.700 So like, uh, I feel like with the, like all of those like community resources where you 242 00:16:58.700 --> 00:17:03.640 have like buses and like metros and all of that, I feel like the major drawback with those, 243 00:17:03.640 --> 00:17:09.260 um, is like the time constraint, as you said, like, um, like that of the UCSD like bus schedule, 244 00:17:09.260 --> 00:17:14.600 like it runs from 6am to like 10pm on weekdays and then it does not run on weekends at all. 245 00:17:14.820 --> 00:17:19.680 So like, um, so like, I, I believe like that is also like another major reason that like 246 00:17:19.680 --> 00:17:25.000 people need more micromobility adoption because those like public transports like do help. 247 00:17:25.080 --> 00:17:29.480 And I think like they're genuinely like the best option, like for, uh, in terms of like 248 00:17:29.480 --> 00:17:34.580 climate conservation, like if you have like electric buses on campus, but, but I definitely 249 00:17:34.580 --> 00:17:38.540 feel like for those like edge cases where you have to travel one mile and like the bus 250 00:17:38.540 --> 00:17:41.520 doesn't go there, like micromobility is the solution to that. 251 00:17:41.520 --> 00:17:45.160 And like, if you just use a car instead, you would have, you would like pollute the environment 252 00:17:45.160 --> 00:17:48.200 much more and like have like a lot more to like take on. 253 00:17:48.340 --> 00:17:51.560 Like, like if you rent an account, it would be like a hell of a lot more expensive. 254 00:17:51.560 --> 00:17:55.980 So like, uh, even in like, uh, even in terms of like finances, I feel like micromobility 255 00:17:55.980 --> 00:17:58.160 makes sense in those scenarios, but yeah. 256 00:17:59.100 --> 00:18:04.700 Um, so you mentioned that you owned a personal vehicle, like the personal micromobility device 257 00:18:04.700 --> 00:18:05.220 in Italy. 258 00:18:05.880 --> 00:18:11.000 Um, so did you ever like, uh, was there ever like a test licensing or like, did you ever 259 00:18:11.000 --> 00:18:12.560 like buy insurance for it? 260 00:18:12.620 --> 00:18:14.700 Did you ever like register it anywhere? 261 00:18:14.700 --> 00:18:18.040 Or did you just like, uh, get it from like a local shop and be done with it? 262 00:18:18.040 --> 00:18:19.420 Like what was the experience? 263 00:18:20.040 --> 00:18:21.960 It's like the last option you mentioned. 264 00:18:22.080 --> 00:18:29.800 I just got it from, from a local shop, no insurance, no, no license, licensing costs or whatever. 265 00:18:29.920 --> 00:18:34.140 Um, uh, and I, I just, I just use it. 266 00:18:34.140 --> 00:18:39.100 If it gets stolen, it's, it's my problem and no, nobody else's. 267 00:18:39.740 --> 00:18:47.360 Um, and that's why I have a pretty, pretty, uh, robust lock to protect it. 268 00:18:47.360 --> 00:18:57.260 And I, you know, I mostly use it, uh, on, on the weekends to, to go to the gym and my gym 269 00:18:57.260 --> 00:19:00.220 is in a safe, in a safe neighborhood. 270 00:19:00.840 --> 00:19:08.180 And especially at the times that I go to the gym, it's, it's way safer than at night. 271 00:19:08.180 --> 00:19:16.480 So I have no problems, uh, about that, but I would, I would, I would carefully consider, 272 00:19:16.480 --> 00:19:23.640 uh, you know, leaving my bike, uh, at night in the center of, uh, of, of my city, which 273 00:19:23.640 --> 00:19:29.040 is by the way, just to, to be precise here, uh, I said, I'm from Venice. 274 00:19:29.160 --> 00:19:34.800 Well, there's the, it's Mestre in Venice because, um, in Venice, you can't ride bikes. 275 00:19:34.800 --> 00:19:38.320 It's just walking and, and water bus and that's it. 276 00:19:38.320 --> 00:19:41.540 Uh, so I'm from Mestre in Venice. 277 00:19:41.700 --> 00:19:47.160 There are cars, there are roads, uh, walking, et cetera, just, just to be, uh, clear and coherent 278 00:19:47.160 --> 00:19:47.520 here. 279 00:19:47.880 --> 00:19:52.340 And that was, that was useful for like the audience of like base and like. 280 00:19:52.480 --> 00:19:55.260 Yeah, especially because, you know, exactly. 281 00:19:55.440 --> 00:19:58.920 I imagine people, maybe they, they visit Venice and say. 282 00:19:59.160 --> 00:20:00.820 No, you can't ride bikes there. 283 00:20:00.920 --> 00:20:02.780 What, what is even talking about? 284 00:20:03.260 --> 00:20:04.220 Uh, that's why. 285 00:20:04.440 --> 00:20:07.980 So were there like any rules about how you can drive and that like people actually follow 286 00:20:07.980 --> 00:20:08.200 them? 287 00:20:08.260 --> 00:20:10.020 Was there any enforcement? 288 00:20:10.420 --> 00:20:11.720 Did anyone ever stop you? 289 00:20:11.800 --> 00:20:17.940 Like, this is like both in like, um, like us and then like, um, in Italy, like it doesn't 290 00:20:17.940 --> 00:20:22.340 really matter if you're like on a, I believe there's like no like difference between the 291 00:20:22.340 --> 00:20:27.720 rules for like electric bikes and like it rules for like, um, rules for like unmotorized 292 00:20:27.720 --> 00:20:31.240 bikes or like, are there any that you're aware of or like, how are they enforced? 293 00:20:31.460 --> 00:20:32.540 Like what's the situation? 294 00:20:33.080 --> 00:20:34.004 Like, uh, 295 00:20:34.004 --> 00:20:41.580 well for, uh, I guess for electric bikes and scooters, um, I guess there are speed 296 00:20:41.580 --> 00:20:45.860 limits, which I'm not aware of, like the, the exact speed limits. 297 00:20:46.080 --> 00:20:53.940 Uh, I don't have one and I rarely use like, uh, here like electric vehicles for micromobility. 298 00:20:53.940 --> 00:21:01.760 So I wouldn't know, um, as far as, uh, as far as like, you know, normal, regular bikes, 299 00:21:01.760 --> 00:21:09.580 uh, uh, are concerned, um, there are, uh, there are, uh, there are, there are very few enforcements 300 00:21:09.580 --> 00:21:17.200 like, uh, you know, people are supposed to, uh, wear helmets or they're supposed to, you 301 00:21:17.200 --> 00:21:23.540 know, uh, just like, don't, don't go over a certain, a certain speed, but nobody really 302 00:21:23.540 --> 00:21:27.960 respects those, those, those norms, those, those enforcements. 303 00:21:28.200 --> 00:21:32.820 I, I, I admit, you know, uh, I, I'm guilty of, of the first one. 304 00:21:32.960 --> 00:21:33.940 I never wear a helmet. 305 00:21:34.500 --> 00:21:36.040 Nobody ever does it in Italy. 306 00:21:36.260 --> 00:21:43.500 And it's very, very common that more than one people, uh, you know, rides on a bike, like, 307 00:21:43.580 --> 00:21:47.720 you know, the, the rider and the one, um, the one behind him. 308 00:21:48.000 --> 00:21:48.920 So behind them. 309 00:21:49.440 --> 00:21:50.280 So, yeah. 310 00:21:50.680 --> 00:21:56.020 And I also saw lots of people on Spins, you know, like a double, double riding. 311 00:21:56.520 --> 00:22:02.360 Uh, so I guess it's, uh, it's pretty, pretty common that, that lots of enforcements are not 312 00:22:02.360 --> 00:22:05.520 respected in, in, in practice. 313 00:22:06.100 --> 00:22:10.940 So the enforcement is like a universal problem, like based on like the two scenarios that we 314 00:22:10.940 --> 00:22:11.620 talked about then. 315 00:22:11.680 --> 00:22:14.255 I, I guess, I guess, uh, you know, 316 00:22:14.255 --> 00:22:18.080 did you ever come across like any signage that asked 317 00:22:18.080 --> 00:22:21.240 you to like slow down or like, I don't know, like wear helmets or. 318 00:22:21.480 --> 00:22:24.600 Yes, yes, yes, I did. 319 00:22:24.600 --> 00:22:30.680 Um, on campus, especially, I remember, um, you know, uh, it's like you, you should wear 320 00:22:30.680 --> 00:22:37.480 a helmet that, that for sure you shouldn't ride in like more than, more than one person. 321 00:22:38.440 --> 00:22:45.540 Um, that's, that's, yes, that's the two that, that I recall from my time at UCSD. 322 00:22:45.900 --> 00:22:51.220 So you mentioned that like people like double ride and that makes it probably like unsafe 323 00:22:51.220 --> 00:22:52.980 for like the pedestrians involved in this. 324 00:22:53.620 --> 00:22:58.780 Um, because like, I, I feel like there's like a, there's more of a chance that like the person 325 00:22:58.780 --> 00:23:00.100 crashes while doing that. 326 00:23:00.420 --> 00:23:04.280 I have personally seen like people on like skateboards, which is like another micromobility 327 00:23:04.280 --> 00:23:10.120 device, um, like carrying someone or like, um, riding, like double riding a skateboard. 328 00:23:10.360 --> 00:23:15.440 And I personally think like those lead to like more crashes than like, um, even like not having 329 00:23:15.440 --> 00:23:17.020 enough experience of riding. 330 00:23:17.020 --> 00:23:19.380 So like, what are your views on that? 331 00:23:19.460 --> 00:23:22.720 Is that like something that like people do because like, they don't really have like enough 332 00:23:22.720 --> 00:23:26.020 budget to like, uh, take, um, separate ones. 333 00:23:26.140 --> 00:23:26.960 Is it like fun? 334 00:23:27.160 --> 00:23:31.580 Is it like something that people enjoy with like their partners or is it just like something 335 00:23:31.580 --> 00:23:35.380 that people do even with friends or like, what's the ground reality? 336 00:23:35.740 --> 00:23:36.665 Like, um, 337 00:23:36.665 --> 00:23:44.340 well, um, I guess there are both, you know, extrinsic factors like, you know, that, 338 00:23:44.340 --> 00:23:47.260 I don't know, weather conditions that the floor is wet. 339 00:23:47.700 --> 00:23:52.700 Um, and it happened to me once, you know, that the floor was wet and I lost control of 340 00:23:52.700 --> 00:24:00.080 the vehicle and I slipped on the floor, uh, or other extrinsic factors might be, um, I don't 341 00:24:00.080 --> 00:24:06.060 know, you know, uh, someone just, just, you know, uh, because sort of like runs you over 342 00:24:06.060 --> 00:24:10.040 bumps, bumps against you and you have no control over that. 343 00:24:10.600 --> 00:24:18.160 Uh, but I guess that it's very important that, um, it's very important to sort of like to, 344 00:24:18.160 --> 00:24:24.400 to be an experienced driver, which is sort of paradoxical because you're supposed to gain 345 00:24:24.400 --> 00:24:26.460 experience while driving. 346 00:24:26.460 --> 00:24:32.620 Uh, but, um, it's like, it's like learning from your mistakes basically as opposed to like 347 00:24:32.620 --> 00:24:34.820 If there's a chance, exactly. 348 00:24:34.820 --> 00:24:40.740 If there's room for mistakes because you, you know, accidents can, I, I, I don't know if fatal, 349 00:24:40.740 --> 00:24:43.180 but they can be very, very, very severe. 350 00:24:43.880 --> 00:24:49.260 Um, it's important to be, to be good, at least good at driving. 351 00:24:49.920 --> 00:24:58.960 Um, and, um, I, I also, I also think that one of, one of the reasons, uh, why, why people 352 00:24:58.960 --> 00:25:06.180 often transgress rules is because yes, they're, they just take things lightly. 353 00:25:06.180 --> 00:25:12.220 And I, I, again, I admit being guilty of that, you know, uh, I don't know. 354 00:25:12.220 --> 00:25:18.020 I was with my, with my girlfriend over there and, you know, we always double ride. 355 00:25:18.440 --> 00:25:22.200 Um, and just, just didn't care. 356 00:25:22.360 --> 00:25:24.640 Nothing ever happened, uh, to us. 357 00:25:24.640 --> 00:25:30.440 And it was just a very, very convenient way of, um, of moving from one place to another. 358 00:25:30.680 --> 00:25:39.620 I don't know, uh, other, other observations from, from the field, I guess, uh, yeah, just 359 00:25:39.620 --> 00:25:43.780 people often, often like to, to, to ride together. 360 00:25:43.780 --> 00:25:50.260 I, I saw like, you know, the, um, I saw lots of times with, with friends, uh, using the, 361 00:25:50.260 --> 00:25:52.600 the shared ride on Spin. 362 00:25:52.600 --> 00:25:58.260 So that's, I guess, an enjoyable experience and like just to something to do, to do together. 363 00:25:58.260 --> 00:26:05.040 And you can go maybe like faster than usual with your friends or just, uh, having a sort 364 00:26:05.040 --> 00:26:06.240 of like race. 365 00:26:06.520 --> 00:26:11.020 Uh, I guess this, this is just, just some thoughts. 366 00:26:11.680 --> 00:26:17.400 But like the shared ride is actually like, um, like separate, uh, Spins that you can choose. 367 00:26:17.580 --> 00:26:20.360 And like every single person like rides like one. 368 00:26:20.540 --> 00:26:21.780 Yes, yes, exactly that. 369 00:26:22.180 --> 00:26:22.840 Uh, yeah. 370 00:26:22.880 --> 00:26:24.280 I just wanted to like make it clear. 371 00:26:24.280 --> 00:26:27.600 And like, uh, it's not the same thing as like two people riding one scooter. 372 00:26:28.060 --> 00:26:32.400 No, as which, which is what like people tend to do, but like there is another like hidden 373 00:26:32.400 --> 00:26:36.280 danger and like shared riding that, like, if like, as you mentioned, like people like 374 00:26:36.280 --> 00:26:37.780 try to like compete with each other. 375 00:26:37.940 --> 00:26:43.100 So like, um, like, yeah, like that might like make them like take like risky turns or like 376 00:26:43.100 --> 00:26:48.900 not slow down when there's like a decline because they want to like go faster to like beat, um, 377 00:26:49.020 --> 00:26:50.500 whoever it is that they're challenging. 378 00:26:50.500 --> 00:26:54.540 So like, I believe like that might like make it unsafe for everyone involved. 379 00:26:55.500 --> 00:26:55.640 Yeah. 380 00:26:55.920 --> 00:27:02.020 So, um, so it's mostly about like romance and like people find it like romantic to like 381 00:27:02.020 --> 00:27:02.940 a double ride then. 382 00:27:03.060 --> 00:27:06.040 Is it, that's the good reason why people like double ride? 383 00:27:06.420 --> 00:27:13.200 I mean, romance, uh, it's just like, I guess, you know, romance is, is, is a factor there, 384 00:27:13.200 --> 00:27:18.180 I guess, uh, because, you know, if you have to, let's say, I don't know, go to the beach 385 00:27:18.180 --> 00:27:24.760 or like go, go watch the sunset in some, some beautiful place, you might use the Spin to 386 00:27:24.760 --> 00:27:25.700 and double ride. 387 00:27:26.060 --> 00:27:26.600 That's it. 388 00:27:26.940 --> 00:27:31.140 So do you think like there should be like, um, micromobility devices that like accommodate 389 00:27:31.140 --> 00:27:31.600 two people? 390 00:27:31.600 --> 00:27:36.480 Because I have seen like bicycles that can like accommodate like two people and like make 391 00:27:36.480 --> 00:27:41.400 it like, like maybe potentially like safer for everyone involved because like, then you 392 00:27:41.400 --> 00:27:45.180 would have like proper space for like two people to even stand because like, if you ride 393 00:27:45.180 --> 00:27:50.420 on like a one person micromobility device, like it might be unsafe, like compared to 394 00:27:50.420 --> 00:27:54.820 the two person one, because like you would actually have space to like stand for both of you guys 395 00:27:54.820 --> 00:27:58.980 and like maybe like some sort of like safety device, if it's like a bike, you can also have 396 00:27:58.980 --> 00:28:02.020 like, uh, I don't know, like proper seats and all of that. 397 00:28:02.020 --> 00:28:07.100 So like, um, would like the, would you think like that concept would like be helpful? 398 00:28:07.520 --> 00:28:13.760 I, I, I think it's a very good point and I actually haven't, uh, haven't ever thought 399 00:28:13.760 --> 00:28:14.280 about it. 400 00:28:14.520 --> 00:28:22.940 I guess if, uh, if like if some, you know, um, vehicles that are like specifically designed 401 00:28:22.940 --> 00:28:29.300 for, for more than one person, like for two people were, were introduced, I would probably 402 00:28:29.300 --> 00:28:35.200 choose that, uh, when, when double riding, you know, uh, it's, it's safer. 403 00:28:35.200 --> 00:28:41.200 It's probably, you know, more, more comfortable to, to ride, um, to ride together. 404 00:28:41.200 --> 00:28:50.080 And now that you let me think there, I, I remember when using the, the, the Spin scooters, uh, 405 00:28:50.080 --> 00:28:56.020 at UCSD, I remember there were like mostly, yeah, two, two types, two types of scooters, 406 00:28:56.020 --> 00:29:04.780 like, um, so I think two models and one was, uh, and they, they slightly differed in, in color. 407 00:29:04.780 --> 00:29:08.600 There, there were two, two tones of two different tones of orange. 408 00:29:08.980 --> 00:29:16.400 And I remember there were, um, like the, the darker orange ones were sort of more robust 409 00:29:16.400 --> 00:29:20.380 and, um, sort of more, uh, more stable. 410 00:29:20.900 --> 00:29:26.220 Um, and that's why I, I often, uh, I often pick them over, over the other, when I had 411 00:29:26.220 --> 00:29:28.580 the, the chance, when there was availability. 412 00:29:29.280 --> 00:29:35.660 So, yeah, I've always seen like, um, I think other than like just the color, like, um, I 413 00:29:35.660 --> 00:29:40.060 saw like three different types of like, uh, handles and like, there were also like these 414 00:29:40.060 --> 00:29:43.020 like standing, like brakes or whatever you want to call them, like stands. 415 00:29:43.160 --> 00:29:46.380 They were like stands that like lifted up the entire, like front of the scooter and they 416 00:29:46.380 --> 00:29:50.820 were like stands that like had like a side, like took, um, like kickstand. 417 00:29:50.900 --> 00:29:55.320 And I believe like the, those are like, uh, like, like, like all of those, like different 418 00:29:55.320 --> 00:29:57.400 models are like different, um, experiences. 419 00:29:57.840 --> 00:30:02.780 Some of them, like, just like some of them had this like, um, thing where they like just 420 00:30:02.780 --> 00:30:05.700 stopped abruptly sometimes and like, or like deaccelerated. 421 00:30:06.020 --> 00:30:10.600 So I believe like that also like contributed to me, like getting this like unexpected, like 422 00:30:10.600 --> 00:30:15.960 joke sometimes where I was just like, um, even though like, because when I'm controlling 423 00:30:15.960 --> 00:30:20.840 something with my own hands, I I'm like sort of like, um, predicting the next move or 424 00:30:20.840 --> 00:30:24.640 like the next, uh, like where I'm going to be in like one second from now. 425 00:30:24.820 --> 00:30:30.740 But if that, but if it like speeds up or like, um, like stops, like all of a sudden, 426 00:30:30.740 --> 00:30:33.360 like it, I might get into an accident, like because of that. 427 00:30:33.360 --> 00:30:38.080 And instead of like, uh, it being a safety feature, because like, let's say if I like 428 00:30:38.080 --> 00:30:42.020 I'm crossing a car and like it stops all of a sudden, like the car might actually like 429 00:30:42.020 --> 00:30:47.300 crash onto me instead of like that being as a, like, uh, that being the safety feature, 430 00:30:47.380 --> 00:30:50.040 like something that like saves me in that scenario. 431 00:30:50.040 --> 00:30:55.740 So, um, I don't know if you've ever experienced that, but like that has been my experience personally. 432 00:30:55.740 --> 00:30:59.860 Like sometimes like when you go to the library work, they just like stop at this like sudden 433 00:30:59.860 --> 00:31:02.080 joke instead of like a gentle deacceleration. 434 00:31:02.360 --> 00:31:07.600 And I think that also like sort of makes things unsafe for like the pedestrians and like even 435 00:31:07.600 --> 00:31:09.580 the micromobility rider himself. 436 00:31:09.580 --> 00:31:14.900 You know, I, I couldn't agree more and I, I absolutely feel the same about it. 437 00:31:14.900 --> 00:31:21.080 Uh, I, I guess, uh, I'm, I'm not sure about this, but, um, I guess there are, you know, 438 00:31:21.080 --> 00:31:27.980 certain, certain areas that are sort of like, uh, mapped on, onto the sort of like Spin map. 439 00:31:27.980 --> 00:31:28.480 I don't know. 440 00:31:28.480 --> 00:31:34.020 And there, um, over those, those, in those areas, there are certain speed limits. 441 00:31:34.020 --> 00:31:35.700 Library Walk is one of them. 442 00:31:36.060 --> 00:31:43.880 And, um, and I actually think it's, it's, it's pretty dangerous when you're, you know, 443 00:31:44.280 --> 00:31:46.420 riding, riding faster. 444 00:31:46.420 --> 00:31:52.780 And then you immediately like, uh, you, you get, you get abruptly stopped by, by the vehicle 445 00:31:52.780 --> 00:31:55.800 or, uh, and you slow down abruptly. 446 00:31:55.800 --> 00:32:02.220 And, but even more dangerous is the opposite when you're going slower and then you don't 447 00:32:02.220 --> 00:32:08.200 know when you're going to accelerate, because you're, you're constantly, you know, um, pushing 448 00:32:08.200 --> 00:32:10.400 the, the, the envelope, the, the accelerator. 449 00:32:11.040 --> 00:32:19.120 And, uh, and then you, you, you abruptly accelerate and that, you know, that was about 450 00:32:19.120 --> 00:32:25.680 to, to make me, make me fall several times, actually, like, I guess almost all the times 451 00:32:25.680 --> 00:32:26.860 that that happened. 452 00:32:27.300 --> 00:32:34.280 So yeah, a safety measure that turns out to be, uh, potentially unsafe, I would say. 453 00:32:34.740 --> 00:32:40.840 Actually, um, now that you mentioned that, I think UCSD has banned micromobility devices, 454 00:32:40.840 --> 00:32:45.760 or like any like motor vehicles on the library to walk from like eight to five every single 455 00:32:45.760 --> 00:32:46.260 weekday. 456 00:32:46.760 --> 00:32:48.100 Were you like aware of that? 457 00:32:48.160 --> 00:32:51.120 Or like, um, is that a rule that you've never heard of? 458 00:32:51.320 --> 00:32:54.580 No, I actually wasn't aware of that. 459 00:32:55.120 --> 00:33:03.480 And, uh, I can say I trust transgressed this, this rule, um, lots of times, but for, for lack 460 00:33:03.480 --> 00:33:10.820 of awareness, I, I, I don't know where, where is written, uh, just out of curiosity. 461 00:33:11.360 --> 00:33:17.820 I'll let you know about the resources after the podcast, but like, um, but like, if you 462 00:33:17.820 --> 00:33:20.680 were aware of this, like, would you still like do it anyway? 463 00:33:20.680 --> 00:33:23.540 Like, like being completely honest with yourself? 464 00:33:23.540 --> 00:33:24.135 Like, 465 00:33:24.135 --> 00:33:30.480 I would say out of, um, probably just out of necessity, I guess. 466 00:33:30.620 --> 00:33:36.380 Uh, but otherwise I, you know, I, I, I, I, I can still remember like different ways to, 467 00:33:36.480 --> 00:33:37.620 to avoid library walks. 468 00:33:37.620 --> 00:33:43.540 So I would have probably taken those, even though they're a bit longer and more convoluted. 469 00:33:43.780 --> 00:33:48.180 So like, like you would like take it when you're, when you have like ample amount of 470 00:33:48.180 --> 00:33:52.600 time, like, uh, like just like reach classes, but like in emergencies, you would just like 471 00:33:52.600 --> 00:33:53.720 take the shortest path anyway. 472 00:33:53.940 --> 00:33:54.780 I, I guess, yes. 473 00:33:54.880 --> 00:33:59.540 In emergency, but also, you know, being an exchange student, I was constantly, I was constantly 474 00:33:59.540 --> 00:34:06.300 sort of like, uh, uh, um, scared of, of breaking rules because you know, uh, the, the, I guess 475 00:34:06.300 --> 00:34:10.700 they're, they're stricter in, in the U S than they are in, in Europe. 476 00:34:10.980 --> 00:34:12.200 That's just a perception. 477 00:34:12.200 --> 00:34:17.480 So I would have been, been, I would have used the, the other routes, I guess. 478 00:34:17.680 --> 00:34:17.960 Okay. 479 00:34:18.140 --> 00:34:18.260 Yeah. 480 00:34:18.480 --> 00:34:23.580 Um, so do you think that there's like need, like, I don't know if you've noticed, but like 481 00:34:23.580 --> 00:34:27.060 on Library Walk, they do not have like any, like bike lanes necessarily. 482 00:34:27.060 --> 00:34:30.560 Like you can still like operate a bike, but do you have to like sort of like maneuver 483 00:34:30.560 --> 00:34:34.220 around like pedestrians and like, there's no like clear marked lanes. 484 00:34:34.700 --> 00:34:36.800 So like, what do you, what do you think about that? 485 00:34:36.920 --> 00:34:39.720 I would say that a bike lane would be much needed over there. 486 00:34:40.460 --> 00:34:40.860 Yeah. 487 00:34:41.240 --> 00:34:47.200 And it would be, would be very, very useful just to, you know, to avoid all, to avoid 488 00:34:47.200 --> 00:34:52.200 all the people when it, when it's crowded and, um, to prevent accidents from happening. 489 00:34:52.260 --> 00:34:52.880 So, yeah. 490 00:34:52.880 --> 00:34:55.180 So it would like solve like both of the problems. 491 00:34:55.180 --> 00:35:00.880 So like one stone, because like you would sort of have this like shortest path scenario, 492 00:35:00.880 --> 00:35:04.300 like, like where, where like you're short on time and you can just like take the shortest 493 00:35:04.300 --> 00:35:07.120 path because there's like proper bike lane infrastructure to begin with. 494 00:35:07.320 --> 00:35:12.480 And then like, you also don't have like actively make this conscious like decision of like 495 00:35:12.480 --> 00:35:16.960 picking, picking like a suboptimal path when you're like short on time and like think 496 00:35:16.960 --> 00:35:18.640 about like the implications of that. 497 00:35:18.640 --> 00:35:23.560 And like, if you ever like not follow the rules, would that like reduce the anxiety around 498 00:35:23.560 --> 00:35:28.540 it or like make the entire experience like more, um, like easy, easy? 499 00:35:29.200 --> 00:35:29.360 Yeah. 500 00:35:29.600 --> 00:35:31.240 Uh, I do think, I do think so. 501 00:35:31.420 --> 00:35:32.180 I do think so. 502 00:35:32.820 --> 00:35:41.420 Uh, I guess bike lane on, on Library Walk and, you know, the adjacent areas would be, uh, 503 00:35:41.420 --> 00:35:46.820 would make it much easier and, and, and safer to, to ride over there. 504 00:35:47.160 --> 00:35:47.420 Yeah. 505 00:35:48.020 --> 00:35:53.540 So, um, moving on to your previous experience and like, um, like when you were like coming 506 00:35:53.540 --> 00:35:57.420 over here, like what your perceptions were about the place and like how they actually turned 507 00:35:57.420 --> 00:35:59.640 out to be, I wanted to ask some questions about that. 508 00:35:59.860 --> 00:36:03.820 So like, um, let's say like you were like the new student over there. 509 00:36:03.820 --> 00:36:08.800 And like, what did you assume like before like landing in that flight, like the States, 510 00:36:09.240 --> 00:36:13.140 like what, like, what did you assume about like getting around the campus and what turned 511 00:36:13.140 --> 00:36:13.900 out to be like true? 512 00:36:14.000 --> 00:36:17.540 Like what was the difference between those two realities, the one that you have, like, 513 00:36:17.840 --> 00:36:21.900 like the reality and like the, like the perceived reality that you had in your head, like before 514 00:36:21.900 --> 00:36:25.340 landing in the States and like living that like university life. 515 00:36:25.340 --> 00:36:37.240 Uh, I would say my expectations were, uh, were met in the sense that, um, I, I expected, um, 516 00:36:37.540 --> 00:36:43.980 that, you know, there, there, there would be, uh, like a micromobility vehicles, like electric 517 00:36:43.980 --> 00:36:46.720 scooters or bikes to move around campus. 518 00:36:47.280 --> 00:36:54.060 And I also expected there would be a bus and I expected all those, those, you know, means of, 519 00:36:54.060 --> 00:37:01.320 of commuting around campus to be, uh, actually to, yeah, to be, to be convenient and to be 520 00:37:01.320 --> 00:37:08.360 efficient, uh, just because, you know, I, I, I got informed, um, about UCSD and there's, 521 00:37:08.420 --> 00:37:14.980 there's plenty of resources about every single, um, area of, of student lives on, on the website. 522 00:37:14.980 --> 00:37:22.280 So that was very, that was very useful to, uh, to craft, uh, and like to, to make myself an 523 00:37:22.280 --> 00:37:24.300 idea of what I, I'd encounter. 524 00:37:25.040 --> 00:37:34.240 Um, but maybe if I, if I, uh, if I hadn't been informed, I would have expected, um, I would 525 00:37:34.240 --> 00:37:41.320 have expected probably like less availability of, of, uh, like, uh, of, of, of these micro 526 00:37:41.320 --> 00:37:48.480 mobility solutions for students, just because, you know, um, I guess as Europeans would think 527 00:37:48.480 --> 00:37:55.920 of, of, uh, America has, as, you know, very, very big places, very long distances that can 528 00:37:55.920 --> 00:38:00.760 be covered only by, um, by owned vehicles, mostly by car. 529 00:38:01.340 --> 00:38:08.060 And that actually didn't turn out to be true in the case of, of, of campus, you know, UCSD. 530 00:38:08.480 --> 00:38:12.820 So like campus, like a, like sort of like a mini city by itself where you can like. 531 00:38:13.400 --> 00:38:14.200 Yeah, that's true. 532 00:38:14.400 --> 00:38:14.840 That's true. 533 00:38:14.960 --> 00:38:19.060 Where you can like actually have like more micromobility, like than like the city itself. 534 00:38:20.020 --> 00:38:24.080 Um, did you ever like try getting around the city using micromobility, like outside of 535 00:38:24.080 --> 00:38:24.520 the campus? 536 00:38:24.980 --> 00:38:26.980 Uh, yes, yes, I did. 537 00:38:26.980 --> 00:38:33.460 Uh, but I would say in order to get to, you know, uh, other, other places of, of, of San 538 00:38:33.460 --> 00:38:39.880 Diego that are not La Jolla, it's, you know, it's just, just the running, riding the trolley 539 00:38:39.880 --> 00:38:42.640 isn't the best, the best solution. 540 00:38:42.640 --> 00:38:45.640 Like it doesn't, it doesn't get you everywhere. 541 00:38:45.940 --> 00:38:50.680 It gets you to the, you know, to most places and it's pretty convenient for those places. 542 00:38:50.680 --> 00:38:58.660 But I, um, often had, you know, the, the often had like, you know, I don't know, commitments 543 00:38:58.660 --> 00:39:05.340 or, or events planned at places that were not, um, easily reachable through, through the 544 00:39:05.340 --> 00:39:05.760 trolley. 545 00:39:06.240 --> 00:39:11.820 So, so, um, like as with like the rules surrounding all of this, like, did anyone tell you about 546 00:39:11.820 --> 00:39:12.340 those rules? 547 00:39:12.340 --> 00:39:17.000 Like, like, I know that you, you read a lot about like the infrastructure itself, like on 548 00:39:17.000 --> 00:39:21.740 the UCSD related basis, but like, were there like any like rules mentioned or like any, 549 00:39:21.740 --> 00:39:26.500 like no go zones or like any sort of like any other rules or like, did anyone else like 550 00:39:26.500 --> 00:39:29.840 inform you about like how you could get around campus, maybe in like some sort of orientation 551 00:39:29.840 --> 00:39:35.180 or any other like orientation email or like how, how, how were those like communications 552 00:39:35.180 --> 00:39:39.420 and are you, were you just like handed over like a link and like, you can just like go 553 00:39:39.420 --> 00:39:44.020 and find your way around campus or like whatever way or like, how was that experience? 554 00:39:44.160 --> 00:39:44.820 Yeah. 555 00:39:44.980 --> 00:39:45.180 Yeah. 556 00:39:45.340 --> 00:39:51.020 Uh, you know, like all that, that information about commuting, commuting around campus was 557 00:39:51.020 --> 00:39:58.060 given to us from the, um, I guess the international student office, uh, at UCSD. 558 00:39:58.360 --> 00:40:02.020 So that was super, super useful. 559 00:40:02.920 --> 00:40:11.600 Um, and yes, otherwise I, I, I, I probably would have only been able to, to, to read the website, 560 00:40:11.600 --> 00:40:18.700 but yeah, we, we as sort of guides for transportation on campus given to us from the international 561 00:40:18.700 --> 00:40:21.220 student office, like department. 562 00:40:21.500 --> 00:40:21.600 Yeah. 563 00:40:21.720 --> 00:40:22.000 Okay. 564 00:40:22.380 --> 00:40:25.940 Were you like informed about them during your orientation as well? 565 00:40:26.040 --> 00:40:28.360 Was there an orientation to begin with? 566 00:40:28.420 --> 00:40:31.480 Cause I'm not aware of the procedure of elect transfers or exchange students. 567 00:40:32.000 --> 00:40:36.180 Um, oh, well, let's say that time passed. 568 00:40:36.180 --> 00:40:43.860 So, but no, no, no formal, formal orientation, uh, beyond the material, the like orientation 569 00:40:43.860 --> 00:40:45.200 material we received. 570 00:40:45.400 --> 00:40:48.220 No, no, no, no, like in-person orientation. 571 00:40:48.720 --> 00:40:48.980 No. 572 00:40:49.860 --> 00:40:50.220 Okay. 573 00:40:50.540 --> 00:40:50.800 Okay. 574 00:40:51.280 --> 00:40:53.520 That is usually the case for like first year students. 575 00:40:53.520 --> 00:40:57.280 So I just wanted to like know what the process is, but yeah. 576 00:40:57.600 --> 00:41:01.760 Um, is there anything that you found like confusing when like moving around campus? 577 00:41:01.760 --> 00:41:07.720 Like anything that you thought was like really confusing or like, um, like me personally, 578 00:41:07.720 --> 00:41:12.320 for, for instance, like I really found like that, like all of those, like Amazon lockers, 579 00:41:12.320 --> 00:41:18.160 like Amazon is like a big player and like, um, e-commerce and like all of that, that we, um, 580 00:41:18.620 --> 00:41:20.400 like readily used. 581 00:41:20.440 --> 00:41:24.360 So like, I honestly thought that like getting to all of those, like Amazon lockers was a 582 00:41:24.360 --> 00:41:28.640 hassle on like, for instance, like since we're like talking about like micromobility, like 583 00:41:28.640 --> 00:41:33.480 I definitely thought like that those like, uh, Spin stations weren't like strategically 584 00:41:33.480 --> 00:41:37.600 located to the, uh, near the location that you would want to like access the most. 585 00:41:37.700 --> 00:41:42.140 Like for instance, like there's a restaurant named like OVT, Ocean View Terrace Pizza. 586 00:41:42.480 --> 00:41:46.480 Like, like it's for like, it's mostly famous for like pizzas and like Italian stuff. 587 00:41:46.640 --> 00:41:52.460 But I, whenever I took the Spin to that area, I did not really have any like proper, um, 588 00:41:52.560 --> 00:41:54.540 Spin stations where I could park the scooter at. 589 00:41:54.640 --> 00:41:59.200 And I had to leave those in like awkward positions and then just like close the ride through the 590 00:41:59.200 --> 00:42:03.680 app or like contact the support team because there was like no strategically placed parking station. 591 00:42:04.080 --> 00:42:08.400 I know that there are like a lot of stations along that way, but like, I still feel like 592 00:42:08.400 --> 00:42:12.680 restaurants are some places where you genuinely like go again and again. 593 00:42:13.000 --> 00:42:37.240 And I feel like having those stations like close to those like, uh, public places, it's just like very, like a sensible solution to do this like entire problem of like Spin scooters, like lying around, especially since I've like talked to some like pedestrians and like this was a major complaint from them that they find like Spin scooters, like facing downwards or like just like, uh, across the street, like, and that like blocks the pedestrian pathway and puts them in the harm's way. 594 00:42:37.240 --> 00:42:41.400 By like forcing them to, like, like forcing them to take the road, for instance, like, and like 595 00:42:41.400 --> 00:42:45.780 get out of the pedestrian zone, like, and then go on the road and then like go up to the pedestrian 596 00:42:45.780 --> 00:42:46.360 zone again. 597 00:42:46.540 --> 00:42:52.560 So like, have you, have you ever faced any such thing or like, uh, what's been your experience? 598 00:42:52.940 --> 00:43:09.900 I mean, I, I, I, I, well, OVT is a great example because, uh, there's, uh, there's no, like there's, I mean, yeah, there are several like, you know, parking spots near OVT, but not one actually, um, actually there. 599 00:43:10.060 --> 00:43:28.160 So I guess there should be more in general, just, just, you know, to, to keep the, to keep the roads, uh, like, uh, tidy and without, without scooters, um, put, put every, like, you know, put in a kind of like not, not orderly manner. 600 00:43:28.160 --> 00:43:51.300 Um, and also if there were more, um, more dedicated parking spots, I guess the, there, like the scooters would be parked, uh, parked better because there, there wouldn't be so much, you know, like, um, so, so many, many scooters parked in just, you know, just few parking spots. 601 00:43:51.560 --> 00:43:57.640 So I, I guess things would be more, yeah, just tidier and more organized. 602 00:43:57.640 --> 00:44:04.920 Yeah, um, I don't know if you've noticed, but like, there's like two different types of like, uh, like bike lane infrastructure on campus. 603 00:44:05.240 --> 00:44:17.140 There's ones that are like, uh, where the bike lanes are actually like on the opposite sides, like, um, it's like the bike lanes are, um, like the road lanes for the, like the lanes for the cars are like sandwiched between the bike lanes. 604 00:44:17.300 --> 00:44:23.320 So the bike lanes are like on either side, like between the car lanes and the pedestrian lanes, like the sidewalk. 605 00:44:23.880 --> 00:44:31.800 And then there's like lanes that is like next to the Ridge Walk, which is like the, like the long strip that like runs along Rimac and like other places on campus. 606 00:44:31.960 --> 00:44:45.800 So like over there you have like, um, both of the bike, like going front and like back, like next to each other and like separated, uh, from the pedestrian walkway via like, like, I don't know, like, uh, divider or like any sort of like plantation. 607 00:44:45.800 --> 00:44:55.740 So like, uh, uh, what, what has your experience been with like, uh, either of those, like, and do you think like one is superior to the other or like, which one supports the need of the students better? 608 00:44:56.180 --> 00:44:57.300 Like, okay, sure. 609 00:44:58.080 --> 00:44:58.600 Hmm. 610 00:44:58.780 --> 00:44:59.140 Okay. 611 00:44:59.240 --> 00:45:05.100 Which I, and I guess, and the question is which one I'd, I'd, I'd prefer or. 612 00:45:05.220 --> 00:45:05.320 Yeah. 613 00:45:05.320 --> 00:45:09.040 Which one, which, which one is like safer, like, which one do you think should be. 614 00:45:09.280 --> 00:45:30.880 I guess, I guess the, the second one, probably, I guess the second one, uh, just, just because, you know, like you, uh, and also I can't remember how, how was the, the separator between the two lanes and then in the case, like, uh, being able to, to go both ways with, was it like, uh. 615 00:45:30.880 --> 00:45:34.080 There was no separator, which is like a white, white line on the road. 616 00:45:34.400 --> 00:45:39.120 Like there was a separator between the, both of those lanes and the, uh, like the pedestrian Ridge Walk. 617 00:45:39.280 --> 00:45:47.260 So there was like a divider, like a plantation that was like dividing those, but like between those two, like, um, back and forth lanes, there was like no divider. 618 00:45:47.420 --> 00:45:49.840 There was just like two green lanes next to each other. 619 00:45:50.580 --> 00:45:51.020 Yeah. 620 00:45:51.160 --> 00:46:07.800 Then, then, yes, I, I definitely, definitely think that the, the, the second option one with, you know, bike lanes on, on either side of the road, uh, are, is, is probably the safest just because you, yeah, you, you don't, yeah. 621 00:46:07.800 --> 00:46:14.040 Um, you, you, you don't risk, um, having, like people going, going against you with, with their vehicles. 622 00:46:14.040 --> 00:46:16.620 It's just like, it's just one direction. 623 00:46:17.180 --> 00:46:17.620 Okay. 624 00:46:18.100 --> 00:46:32.660 But have you ever considered like how, um, if you're choosing that like path where you have like, um, where you have those like bike lane infrastructures, like next to the car lane infrastructure, like the car sort of like just like takes up the bike space as well at times. 625 00:46:32.660 --> 00:46:35.400 And you're like forced onto the pedestrian walkway. 626 00:46:35.400 --> 00:46:37.340 Like, has it ever been a problem for you? 627 00:46:37.480 --> 00:46:39.860 Um, I guess, I guess, yeah. 628 00:46:40.100 --> 00:46:57.660 Um, I actually recall, um, I, you know, like in several, on several occasions, I just, um, I just used maybe for, for, uh, short distances, the, the, like the, the pedestrian walk, uh, right. 629 00:46:57.660 --> 00:47:12.660 So, um, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, and especially, you know, like the, the thing here is the, the, the short width of, of, of the bike lanes, um, that, that I guess is the main problem. 630 00:47:12.660 --> 00:47:34.140 Um, and that's why cars risk just like running over you or like, just being very, very close to you riding. 631 00:47:34.140 --> 00:47:47.200 So now that you've like considered this scenario, like, would you think that the other option was actually safer where you had the micromobility lanes, like separated from everything else and like right next to each other, like back and forth? 632 00:47:47.840 --> 00:47:49.020 Actually, yes, yes. 633 00:47:49.240 --> 00:48:07.500 After, after consideration, yes, it's probably best to, I mean, it's probably better to, uh, have a sort of like, you know, bike, bike accident or just like, uh, then, or a bike collision, let's say, then, then a car collision with a car bike collision, I guess. 634 00:48:07.680 --> 00:48:22.660 Yeah, I think like people when like the same as the case with like authorities, like when they make decisions, like they might consider one argument and like totally disregard the other and like, um, make a decision that like sort of like favors one thing over the other. 635 00:48:22.760 --> 00:48:34.500 So like, yeah, that is a dilemma like that people usually face and like, yeah, in terms of like limited context and like limited like experience themselves because like the authorities usually do not use micromobility infrastructure on campus. 636 00:48:34.500 --> 00:48:41.000 Like it's usually like the students themselves and like, they don't really have that much of a say in like the infrastructure being built per se. 637 00:48:41.860 --> 00:48:43.080 So, yeah. 638 00:48:43.180 --> 00:48:45.280 Do you think like bridging that gap would be like better? 639 00:48:45.440 --> 00:48:47.440 Of course, we'd have like a feedback cycle. 640 00:48:48.000 --> 00:48:48.260 I guess. 641 00:48:48.360 --> 00:48:48.560 Yeah. 642 00:48:48.760 --> 00:48:59.480 I guess the feedback loop is, is a sensible, is a sensible thing or like sensible process to incorporate in policymaking decisions. 643 00:48:59.820 --> 00:49:15.040 And not only in this case, like in the micromobility solutions and infrastructure case, but yeah, just like, um, people or users feedback is, is essential always to, to improve the quality. 644 00:49:15.580 --> 00:49:26.360 Um, moving on to the, like the last section of this, like podcast, like, um, I just wanted to ask you like a couple of like quick questions about like what you would do if you were in that situation or like what you would change basically. 645 00:49:26.860 --> 00:49:35.360 Um, so let's say if you, you had like one year at like UCSD, but if you had like four instead, like, would you have solved something about it? 646 00:49:35.680 --> 00:49:50.220 Would you have like, if you had the position, like if you were, if you were in a position of power or like, like student government, for instance, or like any other like, uh, position where you can like actually change the, like the fundamentals of micromobility on campus. 647 00:49:50.380 --> 00:49:53.440 Like what would you change and like, how do you think like that is justified? 648 00:49:54.460 --> 00:49:56.840 Well, wait, that, that's tough question. 649 00:49:56.840 --> 00:50:15.800 Um, but I guess I would, well, uh, of course, after, after budget considerations, I would probably, uh, I would probably introduce more, uh, like more bike lanes in specific spots. 650 00:50:15.800 --> 00:50:38.280 Like, uh, uh, for example, like, you know, like Library Walk, um, and I justified with, you know, uh, the things we, we said, um, with, you know, the, the place being too crowded and actually, you know, vehicles like electric vehicles running anyway, like in, in, through, through Library Walk. 651 00:50:38.280 --> 00:50:49.000 So, uh, I guess, uh, I guess a bike lane would be, would be much needed and justified, uh, for, for safety purposes and also convenience, uh, reasons. 652 00:50:50.040 --> 00:51:03.060 Uh, then I would probably, I don't, I don't know if it's, it's, if it's already that, that, that frequent light, but I would probably increase the frequency of, of, uh, bus rides. 653 00:51:03.720 --> 00:51:20.960 Um, and, uh, probably increase the, like the, the hours, the running hours, um, even though I, I, I, I guess, you know, like just the drivers must get paid and maybe paid even more for, for awkward times. 654 00:51:20.960 --> 00:51:34.480 Like, you know, like, you know, 1, 2 a.m. Uh, so, and I, I justified with, um, with just like, you know, the, the, the, the need, need to, to, like, to move around campus. 655 00:51:35.600 --> 00:51:42.740 Um, then other things, uh, I, I wouldn't actually know. That's, that's pretty much it. 656 00:51:42.740 --> 00:52:01.660 It's okay. It's okay. We can, like, uh, move over that. Um, so, um, given the fact that you've, like, spent, like, time in, like, both places, like, is there anything that you genuinely, like, find that's, like, missing from, like, the American infrastructure compared to, like, what you've, whatever you experienced in, like, uh, what, what country was it? Like, France? I, I believe? 657 00:52:01.800 --> 00:52:03.080 France. Yeah, France. 658 00:52:03.080 --> 00:52:03.382 Yeah. 659 00:52:03.382 --> 00:52:23.360 So, like, what, what is something that you found that was, like, missing and, like, present over there, but, like, missing over here, given that, like, Europe is actually, like, big on, like, um, posts and, like, like, public infrastructure and, like, I, I believe it's, uh, I don't know the micromobility situation, but I believe it's, like, it must be better than, like, what we have in America. 660 00:52:23.560 --> 00:52:48.600 Well, uh, for, just, like, you know, for the micromobility, I wouldn't, I wouldn't agree that much. I think the situation is, looks, looks pretty good. Uh, I don't know if in America overall, but, like, and, uh, at least in, like, in San Diego, uh, it looks good in terms of, like, just micromobility, um, like, very short, short distances through, through, you know, rented bikes and, and scooters. 661 00:52:49.240 --> 00:53:09.580 Um, I think it's, it's better than, than Italy or France. Uh, but, uh, I guess, yeah, public transportation is, um, the public transportation infrastructure is, it's just, um, better, there are more options, uh, and there are more routes as well. 662 00:53:09.580 --> 00:53:21.260 Like, I, I don't know, for example, uh, I remember using the trolley, there were only, I guess, three, three, um, lines, like three, three line colors. 663 00:53:21.900 --> 00:53:35.420 Um, whereas, like, I guess here in Europe in general, you, you would find way more routes, even to, um, like leading to less, less, uh, common places. 664 00:53:35.660 --> 00:53:42.100 So, I would say more option and more availability and that's, uh, yeah, that's a constraining fact. 665 00:53:42.260 --> 00:53:52.520 And, and even outside, outside of, uh, of the town, like you, there, yeah, there, there are way, way more routes to, to lots of places. 666 00:53:52.740 --> 00:54:05.160 So, do you think, like, having a better, like, improved, like, um, like the trolley network or, like, public mobility network or, like, the bus network basically, like, would also improve the, uh, like, the micromobility usage? 667 00:54:05.240 --> 00:54:17.080 Because, like, in a way, if you think about it, like, um, like, you can go to, like, the major spots using these, uh, like, public infrastructure options and then, like, do the last mile connectivity with, like, a micromobility device. 668 00:54:17.080 --> 00:54:24.840 For instance, like, you can come to UCSD, uh, on a bus and take your bike with you and then, like, use the bike to, like, get to your specific spot on campus. 669 00:54:25.120 --> 00:54:31.680 So, do you think, like, uh, improving the public infrastructure, infrastructure overall, like, would also help boost the micromobility adoption? 670 00:54:32.120 --> 00:54:33.840 I would, I would, I would think so. 671 00:54:34.140 --> 00:54:36.020 I would, I would, I would say so. 672 00:54:36.220 --> 00:54:40.600 And, uh, I would say that, like, you know, the one reinforces the other, right? 673 00:54:41.040 --> 00:54:47.340 Or, I mean, like, yeah, just public transportation usage, uh, reinforces micromobility usage. 674 00:54:47.760 --> 00:54:53.560 So, um, coming to the pedestrian bits, like, I, I believe you must have been a pedestrian at some point as well, right? 675 00:54:53.600 --> 00:54:55.300 Like, during your stay at campus. 676 00:54:55.300 --> 00:55:04.380 So, um, like, seeing at it from the other way around, like, do you think, like, this growing micromobility adoption, like, is actually, like, a threat to the pedestrians? 677 00:55:04.380 --> 00:55:17.220 Because, like, now you have, like, scooters entering onto people because, like, I personally had, like, two accidents with, like, like, when I stopped using scooters for, like, a couple of months, I, like, like, those, um, Spin riders actually ran into me. 678 00:55:17.480 --> 00:55:26.000 So, like, uh, do you think it's actually making the campus, like, unsafe for the pedestrians, which is, like, actually the majority as compared to the micromobility vehicles? 679 00:55:26.580 --> 00:55:30.180 Yeah, I, I, I guess it's a, it's a real concern. 680 00:55:30.420 --> 00:55:40.340 It's a real safety concern, um, to always have, you know, like, just micromobility vehicles running very close to, to pedestrians. 681 00:55:40.940 --> 00:55:57.260 And as a pedestrian, I, you know, I, I actually often, or, you know, like, just sometimes at least I felt unsafe around, around scooters or, or, or, or, or bikes in general. 682 00:55:57.980 --> 00:56:14.760 Um, so, uh, let's say the, the, the further I, I was, as a pedestrian, the, the further I was from, from any type of, of other vehicle, whether a car or, or, yeah, or scooters or bikes, uh, the safer I felt. 683 00:56:15.480 --> 00:56:15.920 Yeah. 684 00:56:16.380 --> 00:56:22.760 So, like, do you think, like, um, people should, like, ban these micromobility devices, like, near, near pedestrians or, like? 685 00:56:22.760 --> 00:56:33.740 Well, um, I, I guess, yeah, I, I guess near, near pedestrians, they should be banned. 686 00:56:34.280 --> 00:56:35.460 They should be banned. 687 00:56:35.600 --> 00:56:40.140 Do you think there should be, like, criminal charges for, like, um, riding a scooter in, like, pedestrian zones? 688 00:56:40.480 --> 00:56:49.180 Or, like, um, if you hit a person with a, uh, like, let's say, scooter or a bike, like, should there be, like, criminal proceedings or, like, would that help the situation? 689 00:56:49.180 --> 00:57:05.040 I, I'd say it's a sensible, uh, it's a sensible thing to enforce, um, especially because, you know, uh, damage can be, can be, can be pretty severe and in general violations, you know, violations can lead to, to severe accidents. 690 00:57:05.040 --> 00:57:09.360 So, I would say fines are, are, are totally, totally justified. 691 00:57:09.760 --> 00:57:12.900 So, like, fines more than, like, prison time or something like that? 692 00:57:13.220 --> 00:57:16.940 Yeah, just, just fines, just fines, no, no prison time. 693 00:57:17.800 --> 00:57:25.880 Because I believe, like, if you, like, have, like, very strict enforcement, like, that would do the opposite and, like, drive down the micromobility adoption because, like, now. 694 00:57:26.200 --> 00:57:26.980 Oh, yeah, definitely. 695 00:57:27.220 --> 00:57:34.780 You're scared to, like, actually, right, because what if something happens and, like, no, all of a sudden, like, their entire life is, like, ripped upside down in a way, so, yeah. 696 00:57:34.880 --> 00:57:40.920 Yeah, you know, your last wish as an international student is to, to find yourself in an American prison, I guess. 697 00:57:41.680 --> 00:57:42.620 Yeah, so, yeah. 698 00:57:42.780 --> 00:57:46.280 I believe, like, they deport you more than they put you in the prison, but, okay, yeah. 699 00:57:46.520 --> 00:57:47.920 Yeah, it's probably true as well. 700 00:57:48.160 --> 00:57:50.840 Yeah, and then you cannot continue your studies, so, yeah. 701 00:57:51.900 --> 00:57:52.260 Exactly. 702 00:57:52.500 --> 00:58:02.580 Have you ever thought about, like, accessibility reasons, like, like, how it's a danger to, like, accessibility because, like, a blind person cannot hear a scooter coming towards them? 703 00:58:02.720 --> 00:58:11.240 And, like, like, a pedestrian might, like, avoid them, but, like, if someone comes on, like, if someone is on, like, a wheelchair, like, a micromobility person could do a lot of harm to them. 704 00:58:11.400 --> 00:58:14.200 And they wouldn't be able to, like, see it or, like, whatever. 705 00:58:14.920 --> 00:58:25.240 I, I actually, I've never thought about, about, about in this, this terms, like, under the, you know, accessibility perspective. 706 00:58:26.920 --> 00:58:43.380 As far as I remember, something that really, really struck me when I was in the U.S., when I was at UCSD, was, like, the presence of, you know, like, kind of, like, accessibility lanes, which is not even a concept where I come from. 707 00:58:44.000 --> 00:58:50.280 So, and I know they're, like, separate and they're far from, from bike lanes. 708 00:58:50.620 --> 00:58:53.640 Like, they're, like, a whole, whole separate track. 709 00:58:54.220 --> 00:59:14.340 So, um, I guess I've never thought about accessibility concerns, but, uh, I also think that, um, like, there are already some, some sort of, like, uh, solutions, like, separate solutions for, you know, bike lanes and, and, uh, accessibility lanes in the U.S. 710 00:59:14.760 --> 00:59:24.200 Um, I don't know that, that I don't know how, how, like, uh, how widespread is the, the presence of accessibility. 711 00:59:24.220 --> 00:59:51.380 So, you know, uh, um, I don't know, I'm in a wheelchair and, uh, I have to go to, to, to, to some place that it's not covered by accessibility lanes that, and in that case, yes, I would, I would, I would, I'd be concerned, uh, because, you know, uh, there's a, there's a lot of, like, uh, risky factors, um, represented by, by other vehicles potentially, you know, running in sort of like into me. 712 00:59:51.380 --> 01:00:21.240 So, um, let's say if you're, like, at this, in this, like, hypothetical scenario, like, and you're in a scooter, and then, like, um, and, like, a blind person comes, and, like, they'll just, like, sort of walk into the micromobility lane, so, like, technically, it is their fault, but, like, they're also, like, not, like, uh, they're, since they're, like, blind, so, like, they couldn't really see anything, and, like, you crash into them, so, like, uh, like, if you're, let's say if you're not, like, actually a pedestrian, but, like, um, like, you're the campus personnel, 713 01:00:21.380 --> 01:00:27.120 like, who do you think would be, like, responsible in such a case, and, like, how should, like, campus handle those, like, things, and, like, how? 714 01:00:27.800 --> 01:00:32.240 Well, uh, you mean, like, only in the case that a vehicle hits a pedestrian, right? 715 01:00:32.540 --> 01:00:35.820 Yeah, but, like, the pedestrian is, like, blind, so, like, they couldn't really see anything. 716 01:00:35.920 --> 01:00:36.880 Yeah, yeah, yeah, sure. 717 01:00:37.540 --> 01:00:39.880 Um, well, uh. 718 01:00:39.880 --> 01:00:43.720 Do you think it's still, like, the motorcyclist's fault, or, like, do you think it's, like, the. 719 01:00:44.600 --> 01:00:49.860 Yeah, I, I, I, I would still think it's the, the, it's rider's fault. 720 01:00:50.120 --> 01:00:50.360 Okay. 721 01:00:50.720 --> 01:01:06.700 Uh, yeah, yeah, uh, you know, like, uh, uh, however unpredictable, uh, could be, like, I don't know, the, could, could have been the, the, the blind person's moves, uh, or the movement, you know, it's, it's a rider's fault, I would say. 722 01:01:07.160 --> 01:01:18.180 Yeah, so, whatever, like, the reason might be, like, you're still responsible for, like, stopping when, whenever something comes into your way, like, even if you're in the wrong place, like, yeah. 723 01:01:18.720 --> 01:01:36.920 Yeah, um, yeah, um, I would agree with that, like, I definitely feel, like, the rider would be at the, like, yeah, because the other person is, is at the mercy of the mobility user, so, like, you are the one with the bigger car, like, the same way if you, like, drive into, like, the car lane, like, the car is responsible to stop for you, 724 01:01:36.920 --> 01:01:49.200 and not just, like, hit into you, so, yeah, um, do you ever also feel, like, scared of, like, cars when using a Spin, like, uh, if the car would, like, hit you, they have, like, 80 airbags, you do not have any safety device, so, like, you're, like. 725 01:01:49.520 --> 01:02:15.800 Yeah, yeah, yeah, I guess, um, I wasn't, I wasn't, I wasn't really, you know, uh, scared, uh, but just, just to, I, I, I always made sure, maybe unconsciously, to take the, the right precautions, and just to, like, to stay at a, like, uh, you know, uh, at a safe distance, even if that meant going sometimes on the, on the sidewalks, you know, the pedestrian sidewalks. 726 01:02:15.800 --> 01:02:33.940 Okay, um, yeah, that makes sense, um, so, anyways, like, wrapping up this entire thing, like, um, is there anything that you think we haven't, like, touched upon, or I should have, like, asked you, but I did not, like, uh, anything that you would want to, like, leave your remarks on, or, like, improve, or, like, anything that you would like to say? 727 01:02:34.800 --> 01:02:53.120 I'd, I'd probably say, uh, just, like, you know, the, um, the use of non, like, non-rented, non-rented bikes, just, like, you know, like, um, I would say, and non, non-electric, non-rented bikes, so, your own bike, and that is non-electric. 728 01:02:53.900 --> 01:03:08.640 Um, I would say that, uh, it's probably, it's probably a topic to, um, to tackle when, uh, you know, when it comes to, to micromobility on campus, just because it's just, like, like, walking. 729 01:03:08.840 --> 01:03:26.420 It's just a very healthy way to, to commute, and I guess it's, uh, you know, if you're for sure that your bike is not, is not getting stolen, or, like, it's very unlikely that it gets stolen, uh, and you, you can also exercise while commuting. 730 01:03:26.420 --> 01:03:37.680 So, I guess it's, uh, it's just, you know, a topic that I would have probably, you know, maybe talked, talked about more, but I, I, I think this interview was very, very comprehensive. 731 01:03:38.260 --> 01:03:55.880 Um, one thing that I actually wanted to bring up, like, now, now that we're, like, wrapping it up, is, like, um, like, when you walk, like, when you use, like, these, like, unmotorized, like, vehicles to, um, get to your class, like, do you also feel like they just, like, um, they just sort of, like, make you tired when you're, like, going there? 732 01:03:55.880 --> 01:04:07.680 So, like, um, like, they actually play, like, a negative effect on, like, like, like, because it's unmotorized, you do not have, like, any assistance, and by the time you go to the class, like, you're already, like, tired and, like, not really doing the class anymore. 733 01:04:07.680 --> 01:04:16.780 Because, like, you might be sleepy, you might be, like, exhausted because of that bike run, and, like, UCC does have, like, steep lines in some place, so that might also, like, play a role. 734 01:04:17.280 --> 01:04:19.420 So, like, how do you, like, tackle that? 735 01:04:19.780 --> 01:04:22.420 Like, how do you think, like, that affects the entire thing? 736 01:04:23.080 --> 01:04:32.720 Yeah, I, I, I do think it's, you know, um, it's probably, um, it, it probably depends on, on the route that you have to take to get to the class. 737 01:04:33.360 --> 01:04:51.240 And now that you let me think about it, um, I, I remember some very steep hills, um, uh, on, on campus that I would have much, much, much preferred to, and I actually, you know, I actually did use motorized vehicles, like, electric vehicles to, to run those. 738 01:04:51.640 --> 01:04:57.680 So, I, I don't know if that makes you so exhausted that you can't follow a class. 739 01:04:57.840 --> 01:04:58.640 I don't think so. 740 01:04:58.720 --> 01:05:05.700 I actually think that, you know, as, as students, we, we just, like, we, we probably sit a lot. 741 01:05:06.060 --> 01:05:12.880 And it's just a very good way to, you know, release the stress and get the, your heart, heart rate up during the day. 742 01:05:13.300 --> 01:05:13.360 Yeah. 743 01:05:13.480 --> 01:05:23.060 Oh, but yes, it's probably not the best option when at night you're tired and after, maybe after class and you have to run the steep hill. 744 01:05:23.440 --> 01:05:24.420 Yeah, that makes sense. 745 01:05:24.480 --> 01:05:30.300 I personally did feel that way, but, um, I, I agree with, like, that, yeah, that might not be the case for, like, everyone. 746 01:05:30.480 --> 01:05:35.720 So, um, moving on to the last question, I just wanted to ask if there's, like, any, if there's, like, any resources. 747 01:05:36.060 --> 01:05:44.800 Um, that you came across that you found, found super helpful when, like, traversing across the campus or, like, moving from the campus to the city. 748 01:05:44.800 --> 01:05:51.840 Like, for instance, there's an app called, like, Pronto, where you get, like, free, um, bus passes, sort of, for UCSD students. 749 01:05:52.060 --> 01:05:59.500 And you can use that to, um, use any of the Pronto passes, like, like, any of the, like, MTSs, buses, or, like, the trolley, free. 750 01:06:00.140 --> 01:06:05.180 So, um, if there's, like, any resources that you come across or, like, anything that you would like to, like, um, 751 01:06:05.240 --> 01:06:08.080 that would help people out, like, whoever's listening to this. 752 01:06:08.620 --> 01:06:20.840 Well, other than Pronto, which is a very valuable resource, um, I guess, well, I guess maybe just trying one of those, like, 753 01:06:21.000 --> 01:06:37.000 I actually did it, like, in one of those promo, you know, promo code websites, like Coupert or something, uh, just to get promo codes for, for writing Spins, um, that actually turned out to be, to be pretty useful. 754 01:06:37.560 --> 01:06:45.180 Yeah, they, I, I mean, not, not always, but, yeah, just, like, you know, a few times, yeah, they, they saved me, they saved me a couple bucks. 755 01:06:45.900 --> 01:06:46.880 So, I was actually happy. 756 01:06:47.360 --> 01:06:54.940 Uh, it's, it's Coupert, Coupert, it's like, it's a Chrome extension that allows you to, uh, like, um, yeah. 757 01:06:54.940 --> 01:06:56.020 What was the name of the site again? 758 01:06:56.020 --> 01:06:58.240 C-O-U-B-R-T. 759 01:06:58.400 --> 01:06:58.600 Okay. 760 01:06:58.940 --> 01:07:05.060 Yeah, that was, um, is there anything else that you would like to share, like, any, like, other resource? 761 01:07:05.740 --> 01:07:11.720 Uh, actually, no, I, I wouldn't, I wouldn't have anything to, to add more. 762 01:07:12.280 --> 01:07:12.720 Sorry. 763 01:07:12.880 --> 01:07:25.760 Um, I think, I think, like, for, like, commuting across from the campus of the city, I think for, um, like, these trolley systems, you could also just use Google Maps because there's an option to, like, tap the trolley button and it'll decide the path for you. 764 01:07:25.900 --> 01:07:32.440 And you can use, like, the, uh, Pronto app to, like, just, like, take free rides if you're, like, a community member of, like, UCSD. 765 01:07:33.160 --> 01:07:41.040 Um, but, yeah, um, and there's also, I believe there's also, like, another app for, like, MTS where you can see the entire network of all of these trolleys and, like, buses. 766 01:07:41.540 --> 01:07:43.160 So, I believe that could be helpful. 767 01:07:43.160 --> 01:07:49.140 And then, like, on campus, I believe there's an app, um, that you can use to spot the bus's live location. 768 01:07:49.900 --> 01:07:53.360 Uh, I think it's called Transcript or Transcript or something. 769 01:07:53.500 --> 01:07:56.720 I know, I actually, something like that, yeah. 770 01:07:57.240 --> 01:08:00.260 So, um, you can use these resources, I guess. 771 01:08:00.540 --> 01:08:02.220 Um, yeah. 772 01:08:02.360 --> 01:08:04.640 So, yeah, that was it for today's episode. 773 01:08:05.020 --> 01:08:08.920 Um, so, thank you, everyone, for tuning in and listening to this. 774 01:08:09.140 --> 01:08:13.420 That was Alessandro, who spent his entire last year as an exchange student in UCSD. 775 01:08:14.260 --> 01:08:19.840 Um, so, we just want to, like, leave it at this and come back for the next episode with another guest. 776 01:08:20.400 --> 01:08:21.420 Um, thank you so much. 777 01:08:21.840 --> 01:08:21.920 Yeah. 778 01:08:22.040 --> 01:08:22.680 Thank you, Yash. 779 01:08:22.980 --> 01:08:23.380 Thank you. 780 01:08:23.640 --> 01:08:24.060 Thank you. 781 01:08:24.060 --> 01:08:24.460 Thank you. 782 01:08:24.760 --> 01:08:24.900 Yeah. 783 01:08:25.320 --> 01:08:26.100 Thanks for listening. 784 01:08:26.260 --> 01:08:26.360 Yeah.